I just don't understand the mindset some people have that Joba being in the pen makes any sense whatsoever. It is the dumbest thing I have ever heard of. I mean, look at the arguements FOR Joba to be in the pen. None of them even hold the slightest bit of water:
The Yankees need an eighth inning guy to be the bridge to Mariano:
Am I missing something here? Have the Yankees NOT made the playoffs at some point in time the last seven years? Have they come in third at any point? And, also, have the Yanks lost ONE playoff series because of their eighth inning guy? ONE series?
The Yanks have made the playoffs every year for the past 7 (since the 2000 series) with a setup crew that has featured the likes of Tanyon Sturtze, Paul Quantrill, Tom Gordon, Scott Proctor, a nearly dead Mike Stanton, Kyle Farnsworth, Steve Karsay, a decaying Jeff Nelson, Ron Villone, Octavio Dotel, and Luis Vizcaino, just to name a few. Look at those names. There isn't a shut down, lights out guy among them. Yet, with the Yanks trotting those guys out in the seventh and eighth innings, they have MADE the playoffs each and every year, won the division every year except last year, and have not been knocked out of the playoffs ONCE because of that eighth inning bridge. What has knocked the Yanks out of the playoffs? Ummm, oh, I don't know, maybe a lack of FRONT LINE starting pitching. So, in the infinite wisdom of Brian Cashman, the yanks are going to take argueably their most talented overall pitcher and move him to a role on the team that is by no means as important? Please!!!!
The Yanks have made the playoffs every year for the past 7 (since the 2000 series) with a setup crew that has featured the likes of Tanyon Sturtze, Paul Quantrill, Tom Gordon, Scott Proctor, a nearly dead Mike Stanton, Kyle Farnsworth, Steve Karsay, a decaying Jeff Nelson, Ron Villone, Octavio Dotel, and Luis Vizcaino, just to name a few. Look at those names. There isn't a shut down, lights out guy among them. Yet, with the Yanks trotting those guys out in the seventh and eighth innings, they have MADE the playoffs each and every year, won the division every year except last year, and have not been knocked out of the playoffs ONCE because of that eighth inning bridge. What has knocked the Yanks out of the playoffs? Ummm, oh, I don't know, maybe a lack of FRONT LINE starting pitching. So, in the infinite wisdom of Brian Cashman, the yanks are going to take argueably their most talented overall pitcher and move him to a role on the team that is by no means as important? Please!!!!
You want to protect Joba's arm:
Why is pitching in the bullpen so much better for Joba's arm? Simply because of the innings? How about the constant use? I don't know, but I seem to recall Joe Torre wearing out a lot more relievers than starters in his time here. Why? Because of innings? No, because he used a guy two or three or four days straight. Having Joba in the pen doesn't mean you are protecting his arm, it simply means you are limiting innings. Well, less innings over a shorter period of time in more difficult situations (stress filled eighth inning moments) may actually do MORE HARM to his arm.
He will start in the pen and then move to the rotation:
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Dumbest thing I have heard the Yanks say yet. So, let me get this straight, you are going to start Joba in the pen, make him the eighth inning guy, make him the bridge to Mariano, and then, in the middle of the season, you are going to send him down to the minors for a few weeks, have him stretch it out as a starter, and then use him as a starter for the second half of the season? How the he.ll does any of that make any sense?
First, wouldn't it be smarter to, oh, I don't know, START Joba in the first half see what you have, and THEN move him to the pen? What if he isn't that great in the rotation? Then, moving him back to the pen wouldn't be a big deal. You know what you would be getting from him there. But how could you possibly justify moving him out of the bullpen if he has been doing well, into the rotation with no guarantee as to how effective he could be, for a SECOND HALF RUN!!!!!!!!!! Idiotic.
Plus, let's face it, it is absurd to believe that the yanks are actually going to send Joba down to the minors, in the middle of what promises to be a hotly contested season, to get some reps in as a starter before coming back up. Oh yeah, I'm sure that would go over really well with the fans, the media, and the players. "Hey guys, know your busy fighting the Sox for first place and battling the Indians for the wild card, but just wanted to know if some of you could help bring some of Joba's things down to the car since he is gonna be going back to Scaranton for a while to work on his curve ball. Thanks fellas." Oh yeah, that would be some smart baseball.
If Joba starts the season in the pen, he FINISHES the season in the pen, case closed.
It is the only way to limit his innings:
HUH? Are people serious when they say this? This is sort of like saying "my car ran out of gas, so the only thing I could think to do was to smash the windows in and dump it in the pond, then claim it had been stolen to collect the insurance money." All those PHDs and supposedly smart baseball people, and NONE of them could conceive of a way to keep a pitcher's innings down without bouncing him around between the pen and the rotation like a ping pong ball on HGH?
Hey, let me take a stab at it. How about, oh, I don't know, JUST LIMITING HIS STARTS!!!!!!!!!!!!! How hard would it be to rest the kid every now and again? With Joba in, Kennedy would become the sixth starter, meaning that, from time to time, when the Yanks wanted to give Joba a rest, they could plug Kennedy in there. How hard is this? The Mets have been doing it for years with Pedro. In April, most of the time you don't even use your fifth starter because of the days off. Well, this time, just plug in that fifth starter. Then, in May, give the kid a few starts off, same thing in July, which would be even better because of the All Star break, and the kid should be fine to go.
Hey, let me take a stab at it. How about, oh, I don't know, JUST LIMITING HIS STARTS!!!!!!!!!!!!! How hard would it be to rest the kid every now and again? With Joba in, Kennedy would become the sixth starter, meaning that, from time to time, when the Yanks wanted to give Joba a rest, they could plug Kennedy in there. How hard is this? The Mets have been doing it for years with Pedro. In April, most of the time you don't even use your fifth starter because of the days off. Well, this time, just plug in that fifth starter. Then, in May, give the kid a few starts off, same thing in July, which would be even better because of the All Star break, and the kid should be fine to go.
Or, how about this, how about letting the kid get a few freakin innings under his belt, huh? I seem to remember the Tigers being cautious with Verlander but the kid PITCHED. He was big, strong, and worked through any dead arm issues. Now, he's a 200 innings a year pitcher. Why not let Joba have a stab at it? The kid is big and strong. Maybe you don't need to coddle him so much and maybe you need to let him pitch more than 140 innings this year. Maybe you let the kid play baseball. Maybe, Cashman, you put the pocket protector down for a minute and let a kid pitch. They used to actually do that in the old days, you know. Actually turned out okay for some people.
If you're one of the people sitting there thinking that I'm crazy and Joba NEEDS to be in the pen, ask yourself a few questions: 1.) name the other team in baseball that has their most talented, valueable young pitcher, who proved he could dominate as a starter in the minors and doesn't have a serious risk of injury issue, slated to be their eighth inning guy? If it was such a big, important position, you would think that most teams would have their best pitchers in that slot, right? 2.) what are the names of the CLOSERS, never mind the set up men, who have won championships over the last several years? Give up? Do names like Jenks, Wainwright, Foulke, and Looper ring a bell? You can win with pretty good bullpen pitching, you CAN'T win with okay starting pitching. 3.) how confident are you in the rotation Cash-Man has built for this year? Let's assume Pettite and Wang are stable and perform to their usual standards. With Joba in the pen, that leaves Hughes, Kennedy and Mussina. Let's look at this rationally. Hughes is the only one of the "big three" that showed himself to be exceptionally fragile, injuring himself twice last year. We are suppose to believe he is more of a lock to pitch deep into games and rack up innings without getting hurt than Joba is? Why, exactly? Joba didn't get hurt last year, Hughes did. Why is Hughes going to be more durable with more of a load. How about Kennedy? What, exactly, has this kid done to deserve any kind of confidence? He was with the team for a cup of coffee last year and didn't pitch in one meaningful game. He'll pitch in higher pressure games in the middle of April against the Sox this year. How about Mussina? The only reason we know what Kennedy looks like is because Mussina was so bad, was so washed up, Torre didn't think he could afford to put the dried up well of a pitcher on the mound anymore. Is anyone getting 200 innings from the body formerly known as The Moose? Wouldn't you want to keep your most talented pitcher in that kind of rotation to not only make it deeper, but give you a better chance to win games from the minute they begin, rather than hoping they get to the eighth inning on every other day so Joba can pitch? 4.) is it easier to replace Joba in the pen or in the rotation? I believe Joba has the chance, the makeup to be a Beckett, Peavy, Oswalt, Halladay type of lock down pitcher. He has the chance to be that rare pitcher: dominant and intimidating. That's what I believe and I think a lot of other people believe the same. So, let's ask it this way, would it be easier for the Sox to replace Beckett or Okajima? I would say Okajima is a little easier to replace, wouldn't you say? Or, how about this, has it been easier for the Yanks to replace the starters they had during their dynasty run, or the bullpen guys they had during that time? I don't know about you, but if you told me I could have this starting staff with the Stanton, Nelson, Mendoza, bullpen, or this bullpen with Cone, Wells, Hernandez, Pettite, I'll take them starters any day of the week and twice on Saturday.
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